Toyota debunks the Hummer vs Prius myth
For those that don’t know both Agnes and I drive Toyota Prius hybrids. Hers is a 2006 and mine is a 2005. I was a Prius zealot before I even owned one, but once we got the 2005 Agnes became one as well. We’ve even convinced a few friends to go the hybrid route when they purchased a new vehicle.
Here’s a [nerdy] picture of us and our cars:
I could go on and on about why the Prius is probably the best car for most people but here’s a short list:
It is much larger than you’d think. It’s comparable to the pre-2006 Camry in interior space.
It gets incredible gas mileage. I’ve never had a tank under 45 MPG.
It’s reasonably priced, with models that start at $22,000.
It’s a Toyota.
About the only downside of owning a Prius is that I’m constantly being challenged by people with the “latest news” about why my purchase was a mistake, not actually green, etc. The anti-Prius crowd can be downright nasty at times, with their hatred of my car going past a simple disagreement and bordering on psychosis. It’s like the anti-hybrid people want to make me ashamed to drive a Prius while they run me off the road in their Chevy Avalanches.
I can thank the Detroit-funded shill CNW Research — the “Research” in the name being used loosely due to their questionable methods and findings — for the latest round of “proof” for the anti-hybrid. Basically the CNW report tried to say that from production through useful life the GMC Hummer H3 was a much “greener” vehicle than the Toyota Prius. While the findings in this “report” flew in the face of reason and common sense, local news affiliates were quick to republish the findings as fact and muddy the waters.
Thankfully Toyota debunked that myth.
From Toyota’s Hybrid Synergy View newsletter:
HEARD THE ONE ABOUT THE HUMMER?
Some readers of Hybrid Synergy View say they’ve heard about a report that claims a Hummer H3 sport utility vehicle uses less energy per mile driven than a Toyota Prius sedan. Not surprisingly, Prius fans who take pride in their cars’ energy efficiency are confused by this claim.
The report, published earlier this year by CNW Marketing Research, Inc., is titled “Dust to Dust: The Energy Cost of New Vehicles From Concept to Disposal.” It is said to measure in dollars and cents all the energy used in creating, building, operating and disposing of each vehicle over its entire lifetime. The report says a Prius costs $3.25 per mile to operate, versus just $1.95 a mile for the Hummer H3.
In May, a response from the Pacific Institute said of the CNW report, “The little supporting evidence that it has released suggests that the contentions in the report are, at best, unproven, and are likely wrong: the result of faulty analysis, untenable assumptions, manipulation and misuse of facts and data, numerical mischaracterization, and inadequate review.”
Because of its remarkable claims, however, the CNW report has been circulated widely and quoted in the media, continuing to spur questions from consumers.
Vehicle life and lifetime miles
For example, the Prius is assumed in this report to be driven only about 9200 miles a year, and to have a service life of less than 12 years and 109,000 miles. CNW assumes the average Hummer H3 will travel 207,000 miles over a lifetime of 15-plus years. The H1, incidentally, is assumed to have a lifetime of nearly 35 years, with 379,000 total miles.
According to data from the New Vehicle Consumer Study by Maritz Research, Prius owners plan to drive their vehicles an average of over 14,600 miles per year. And if Prius hybrids last only the 12 years assumed by CNW Marketing Research, Inc. — also an unsupportable assumption, given the substantially greater service lives of other Toyota vehicles — they would still rack up more than 175,000 miles in their lifetime.
Production costs versus operating costs
Using another puzzling assumption, the CNW report seems to assign the majority of a vehicle’s lifetime energy input to its design, development and production. We turn again to the Pacific Institute, which cites five independent studies showing that the operation of a vehicle is responsible for at least 73 percent and as much as 90 percent of its lifetime energy cost.
One of these studies, from the Argonne National Laboratory, is quoted as concluding that “around 74% of all hybrid and internal combustion vehicle energy use comes from the operation of the vehicle.”
Pacific Institute quotes the MIT study “On the Road in 2020″ as saying that a comprehensive life-cycle energy analysis found that “80% to 90% of all energy was used in the operation stage, 7% to 12% in the materials production stage, and the remainder in vehicle assembly, distribution, and disposal.”
So, with lifetime energy cost divided by lifetime miles, as in the CNW report, Prius’s per-mile energy input would be substantially better than is shown in that report, and better than that of a Hummer.
Our method of measurement
Toyota, meanwhile, employs its own standard to measure each new vehicle’s environmental “footprint.” Toyota’s Eco-VAS, or Eco-Vehicle Assessment System, is a tool for predicting and reducing the environmental impact of its vehicles. It also measures the energy required in a vehicle’s production and operating stages, but goes beyond analysis to provide a framework for design changes that improve environmental performance.
Toyota’s engineers use Eco-VAS all through the process of design and development and leading to production — measuring a vehicle according to six critical standards: fuel efficiency, exhaust emissions, external vehicle noise, lifetime environmental impact, recyclability and the reduction of substances of concern.
In design and production, these standards lead to the replacement of hexavalent chromium, lead and other substances of concern, lower the use of in-plant energy, and employ some plastic parts made from agricultural products rather than petrochemicals.
In the operating stage of a vehicle’s life, Eco-VAS improves fuel efficiency, produces fewer greenhouse gases and smog components, and cuts the impact of batteries, tires, oil and parts used in maintenance.
And, in the recycling and disposal phase, Eco-VAS standards improve the collection and reuse of recyclable materials, provide for easier dismantling and prevent the production of harmful waste.
The bottom line
The people at Toyota are no strangers to environmental awareness and to the positive changes that benefit both our consumers and the world they inhabit. With Eco-VAS, we’re taking giant steps to do even better.
And Prius owners, knowing the facts about the gentle environmental impact of their cars, continue to be proud of the choice they’ve made.
Editor’s note: Readers interested in CNW’s full 458-page report may find it at:
http://cnwmr.com/nss-folder/automotiveenergy/DUST%20PDF%20VERSION.pdf
The Pacific Institute response can be seen at:
www.pacinst.org/topics/integrity_of_science/case_studies/hummer_vs_prius.pdf
The Summer 2006 Hybrid Synergy View article on Eco-VAS is available at: http://www.toyota.com/html/hybridsynergyview/2006/summer/ecovas.html
I have no idea if you even read this anymore but I’m gona respond to this anyway.
You don’t mention in this article anything about the environmental cost. The nickel used for the batteries for the Toyota Prius comes from Canada, it is shipped from Canada to the UK for refining. From there it is shipped to Chine for further refining before it is shipped to Japan. Toyota buys 1000 tonns of nickle from that mine, which has left the landscape ruined from sulphur pollution and acid rain.
Anyway, that is not my point. From my experiance the environmental cost of steel, aluminum and other resources is about the same.
I would like to point out to you that most auto industry experts agree the hybrids are not here to stay but only experiments for future powertrains. Internal combustion will remain the primary source of transportation power for decades.
Even today modern internal combustion engines and diesel engines can achieve the same, better or close to, mpg figures as the hybrids. The Auto Express magazine compared other fuel efficient cars to the Prius. The Prius, achieve the 10th place with the Citroën C4 Coupé 1.6 HDi achieving the first place.
The Dies-Otto engine, prototype engine Mercedes is working will achieve 40+ mpg. 1,8L engine which combines the internal combustion engines with the diesel engines. Rated 241 hp, it generates almost no nitrogen oxide and less carbon dioxide per liter of fuel consumed than current diesel engines and could be run on ethanol. They are designing that engine for their 4500 pound S-Class. They predict smaller engines, suitable for the normal cars could achieve 40-80 mpg and even less emissions. They are working on putting flywheels in their new models, storing energy as you brake and use that energy when you drive off at lights and go up hills. Mercedes are doing anything they can to improve the combustion engine. The hybrids are only a quick fix for a much larger problem. The European auto industry is going other ways than the US and Japanese. The European industry is relying on advancing the current technology, bringing smaller engines to their cars. You can get a VW Golf GT with a 1,4L TSI, which stands for Turbocharger Supercharger Injection, gets great mpg, low emissions and has 170 hp.
The Top Gear show did a rather interesting test in their last episode. They drove the Prius 10 laps around their track. The also drove a BMW M3, 420 hp 4,2L V8 around the track behind the Prius. At those speeds the Prius achieved 17 mpg while the BMW achieved 19 mpg. A new study concluded that the Land Rover Discovery was more environmentally friendly than the Prius.
It is not what you drive what matters, it is how you drive that really counts.
Here in Iceland they held a competition this year. Economical driving, in that competition a Ford GT, 5,4L V8 550 hp, achieved 25 mpg.
The car has simply been made a scapegoat for the causes of global warming. New laws are being passed both in EU and in the US that forces the autoindustry to achieve a certain amount of emissions standards. They are forcing them to reduce their emissions, which will cost them untold amount of money. Porsche, not known for making environmentally friendly cars, are buying VW to gain access to their fuel saving technologies.
Yet, you never hear anything said about airplanes, ships and rails. You never hear them talking about more environmentally friendly airplanes.
So, what I suggest is. Buy a small diesel car, pollutes less and gets better mpg.
Thanks for the comments, Siggi.
The “environmental cost” argument — especially the nickel & Sudbury part — has been debunked as well here: The Car Connection
I agree that hybrids are just a [big] step in a march towards the future of autos, but they are the best cars on the street for so many motorists for so many reasons. Saying that the ICE is here to stay really means what though?
So often people dismiss interim solutions or advancements because they aren’t a total solution. The hydrogen car isn’t available to us yet. The Prius, on the other hand, has been around since 2001 and is generally accepted as a proven and reliable technology.
The Citroën C4 Coupé is a nice little gas saver but the comparison doesn’t really hold weight with me for a few reasons: The Prius is a four-door midsize sedan and not a coupe. The Citroën is not available in the US.
Even a Ford Festiva compares favorably to a Prius if you want to go raw gas mileage…
Now these “tests” where auto magazines and other car companies find ways to put the Prius in a situation where it will look bad against a car that is not nearly as efficient in real life. That’s dishonest, in my opinion, and counterproductive. We’ve been driving our Priuses/Prii for three years and they regularly achieve great gas mileage in mixed driving conditions. Anyone that wants to disagree is, well, wrong.
I think it’s great that so many auto companies are finally looking to innovate in the direction of gas efficiency, emissions, and so on. They stupidly spent the last 50 years trying to squeeze more horsepower and size into vehicles as streets became more crowded and American highways became parking lots.
Clean diesels, diesel hybrids, and plain ol’ ICEs that get great mileage on their own are all great ways to tackle the energy issues we face. The Prius is real, tested, and available for purchase in the US. Understanding that the US is not the only auto market in the world I’m glad to hear there are traditional ICE cars and new diesels that can compete with the Prius.
You nail some facts really well. I hadn’t seen the nickle myth debunked.
The auto magazines aren’t comparing the Prius to other similar cars since they and Toyota try to focus on the mpg the car gets. So they show people that there are other and better options than buying Prius, ofcouse it depends on if people are looking for the best mpg and not the size of the car.
Not sure if Scoda Octavia is sold in the US but it can be compared to the Prius in size. Anyway, they managed to drive in a diesel Scoda Octavia around Iceland, 832 miles, on one tank.
My point and frustration towards a bybrid car is that people shouldn’t be blinded by the fact it is a hybrid car. It won’t change much if they still drive agressively, sure it depends alot on the car but it also depends on how you drive and that is really an important step. I’m driving along at normal speed, 60 mph and then a Prius shoots past me doing 70 or 80 mph, they are not saving any gas nor CO2 emmissions
A recent poll in the US showed that 72% of the people said they would buy a hybrid car, it fell down to 46% when they were told they needed to pay more for them. Even Ford is losing 5000$ on every hybrid they sell. The Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid won the ‘Green car of the year’ award in the US. It has a 6L V8, and can run on electricity up to 30 mph, not really a environmentally friendly option and Chevrolet are supriced at slow sales. One of the things that has to change is the auto culture in the US and it is finally happening as smaller cars are showing stronger sales. GM and Ford have recently had to close down plants producing SUVs and Pickups.
The bybrid market will be not long lived since they are facing serious material shortage in the near future, depending on if they continue to use this current technology. Dysprosium is required for to fabricate the advanced electric motors. 95% of the worlds supply is in China and it is expected that it will be consumed by 2012. Using the worlds current electric car battery technology available it is only possible to convert 1/3 of the cars in the world to electric cars.
Here comes my second grudge against the hybrid cars. Now this is entierly my opinion. I feel that auto companies shouldn’t be developing hybrids. I feel that they should instead develope the ICE and diesel engines since it is a tecnhology they are familiar with and instead of spending millions on hybrid cars, develop something else like hydrogen and other new technologies like cars running on compressed air and water, crazy ideas but might work.
It is far from a simple task. The cheapest way of producing hydrogen is from oil. Another option will come with the next generation of nuclear reactors where hydrogen will produced in the progress however that is not an option since current reactors use U-235 which is only 0,7% of all natural uranium and if we changed to nuclear powerplants the worlds uranium supply would only last 30-40 years. Still, the major problem facing hybrid cars is how to store it. My physics professor is currently working on experiments where he tries to bind the hydrogen in various ways to store it. The person who finds an efficient way of storing hydrogen will become the world richest person.
Electric cars, where are you gona get the electricity for all the cars? Through oil, coal and gas powerplants. Biofule is a great way but not really an option with the price of food rising every day. Brazil is compleatly energy self sufficient. It is illegal to sell gas which has less than 20% ethanol in it and all cars sold there have to be able to run on E80 gas.
We are facing alot of troubles and hybrids are certainly not the way out of them like many people think. A scientist, which name I can’t remember, predicted global warming in 1970 and when asked what we could do to fight against it he said: “There are alot of things you can do, but none of them are things you want to do.”
And since I mention global warming, you should watch if you haven’t already http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=global+dimming&sitesearch=#
To those who are giving their opinion, read your message before you submit it. There are so many misspelled words (typo’s) and grammatical content (especially SIGGI), which makes you look stupid!
Give the guy a break, he’s not a native English speaker. Siggi made some interesting points and I appreciated the opportunity to have a conversation about hybrid cars with someone as far away as Iceland.
FYI: Apostrophe misuse also makes people look stupid.
My wife and I have owned a 2007 Prius for about 2 months. Previously drove a 2004 Nissan truck.
Recently we drove from Houston to Austin, averaging on the highway 80 mph. During that trip we still averaged 43 mpg, which is at least double the mpg of a pickup driving at just 60 mph.
Also, a couple weeks ago we drove a 9 hour trip to Arkansas with mixed driving conditions ranging from “stop-n-go” (0-50 mph) to freeway (65-80 mph). We averaged 52 mpg on that trip, and drove from Austin, TX, to south central Arkansas without stopping for gas. We didn’t have to get any more gas until the drive back to Austin.
Enough said.
The Toyota Prius may be a fantastic car with low environmental impact but the harsh reality in most countries is that it is priced way out of reach of the bulk of the motoring public. Therefore it smaller contribution to carbon emissions is meniscule.
Leon
Leon, I disagree.
According to the National Automobile Dealers Association, the average price of a new car sold in the United States is $28,400 [1].
A Prius with Package #2 (rear camera, VSC) is ~$24,000.
[1] http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/consumer/autos/aut11.shtm
In the RSA:
A Toyota Prius costs R299,000.
A C Class C180K Classic costs R300,000.
A BMW 320i Start Steptronic costs R302,000.
Guess which two superbly engineered luxury German cars I would prefer.
The Prius is a Toyota and has bland styling and the hybrid technology is extremely complex. The nickel iron battery pack will also be extremely expensive to replace. In the RSA only 1 million Prius’s have been sold since its introduction.
Leon
Hey truck driver? In response to your spelling and grammar lecture… there’s no apostrophe when you pluralize typo.
@Siggi
Not big enough. Crap performance. Dirty local pollution. Wakes the neighbours.
As a Prius owner, I am aware that the car is not environmentally friendly. But then, no car is. If you look at the production workflow for any vehicle (and most products these days) there is a vast amount of shipping that is wasted on parts and core material. There seems to be a problem with the extraction of the base materials for the battery in Canada, which obviously needs looking at on a global scale, but to be honest, how many of us take enough care over the sourcing of the things we buy? Does Toyota, or every Prius owner have to take flak for every single stage of the production of every single piece of the vehicle? Or should, you know, the company that is polluting Canada not take the blame?
As I said, no car is great for the environment. If I want to be environmentally friendly, I walk, failing that I cycle. I buy a hybrid that is a product of the Tokyo summit, is guaranteed carbon neutral by the supplier, gives me great mileage in relative luxury and doesn’t pump out much from the exhaust and I keep it for at least ten years. As for a ’statement’, well how many of these new hybrid/electric/hydrogen cars do you think would have gone into production if the Prius hadn’t shown the moribund car industry that the buying public WANTS this kind of vehicle?
And to be honest, I just bought it because I quite liked the idea and the car itself. I did not sign up to be some communist hemp-wearing Swampy.
@damonnoisette
By the way, how much does a replacement battery cost and how is it disposed of? Is there additional charge for that disposal?
Wait, why would people not like hybrid technology but like new combustion technology, or in fact, *any* new propulsion/power technology? A hybrid vehicle is just a dual-power vehicle. It uses electricity to propel the vehicle, and it it uses combustion to propel the vehicle — in an either/or way. (It also usually has “regenerative brakes” which means when you brake you get some electricity back).
In other words, you take two technologies and use both to power the system in tandem. The technology involved is really: how do we fit two systems into one car, and how do we maximize the two system’s individual benefits to make a better car.
If you like the new combustion engine technology coming out, why would a hybrid preclude your use of that technology? Why couldn’t you put that new tech into an even better hybrid? (There may be reasons, such as size that might prohibit it, but I would not just *assume* that).
Indeed the use of flywheels, fuel-cells, etc, are all just more power technologies. Maybe some of them can be used by themselves to power a car, maybe some may not. Any that would be used together is what a hybrid car is.
The current cars just use whatever the current electric drive and combustion drive technology. There is nothing stopping us from combining different technologies or better of the same technologies, except for the engineering and economics that lie in the details.
Anyway, what do I drive? A 1999 New Beetle. Why? Well in 1999 there weren’t any good cars to buy anyway but I needed a car to do my job. Why haven’t I bought a Prius or something better? Well, because my car still works — if I sold it or otherwise disused it, I would not likely be making anything “greener”.
You must figure in that *someone else* will be driving the car regardless of myself, so it’s lifetime would still exist. All I would be doing is adding a new car to the population. In otherwords, it’s probably best to continue to use my car until it “dies” than to “consume” another prematurely — even if that one is “greener”. Would you throw away a half-eaten meal for a cheaper one?
there seems to be a lot of hype about the latest batch of electric cars to be released shortly, i.e Mini, Leaf etc and these manufacturers claim that they are zero emission cars.
I would like to contest this claim and say that they are zero running emission but certainly not zero overall emissions.
Some of the coal fired power stations produce more carbon emissions to charge the batteries than would a modern clean burning turbo diesel. If however the powerstations were powered by renewable energy i.e. hydroelectric, wind, wave etc then of course the situation changes.
I can’t see electric cars really gaining a foothold. Those batteries are simply far too heavy and far too costly to replace.
The problem with a small car like a Prius is if it collides with a Chevy Avalanche, the people in the Prius are going to sustain far worse injuries than the people in the Avalanche. Basic law of physics bigger and heavy vs smaller and lighter, crash ratings notwithstanding.
I’d imagine that’s the same danger that someone in a Porsche or other small sports car would have in a collision with a bigger vehicle.
By the way, my 2005 Prius was totaled back in November by a driver in a Ford F350 that decided not to stop at a red light. My wife was driving and managed to avoid the full-on t-bone but still got hit pretty badly in the passenger side front quarter-panel. My wife was ok and the car did amazingly well. It still ran after the accident but the bent frame was enough to make it a total loss.
I know Toyota offers recycling through dealers and that a majority of the Prius — including battery — can be recycled.
AFAIK and have read there have not been any warranty replacements made to batteries on the Gen 2 models so far. Also, individual cells can be replaced in the event of an issue and used battery packs can be found on eBay for $500-600 with low miles/usage.